What to Make of Jamal Turner at Quarterback

It's hard to take the move of Jamal Turner to quarterback as a vote of confidence for the other options Nebraska has at the position.  Whether he's meant to be a Wildcat quarterback, a backup, or a potential starter, it doesn't send the message that the Huskers have an over-abundance of depth behind center.

 

Depth
During the 1994 national championship season, NU lost Tommie Frazier to blood clots.  Brook Berringer punctured a lung.  Walk-on Matt Turman was pressed into service.  Tom Osborne invited after Tony Veland to return to quarterback (a position he'd played earlier in his career).  Veland was undoubtedly an outstanding athlete, but the move was more telling about the position's depth than Veland's talent.  If depth is the  motivation for moving Turner, that suggests that there aren't enough quality options at the position.

A Fresh Start
Taking things further, it's possible that Turner isn't only desirable from a depth perspective but that he could have the potential to emerge as a starter.  Given he's spent very little time practicing at the position in his 3 years in Lincoln, that's not terribly appealing.  Any new starter at quarterback is going to make their share of mistakes.  Paul Thompson moved from receiver to quarterback at Oklahoma and still managed to win a conference title.  Of course, Thompson, had already spent most of his career at OU preparing to play quarterback.  That's not the case for Turner.  If Turner has growing pains, NU won't benefit in future years because he's already a senior.

Wildcat
The Wildcat has been a useful and productive formation for a number of teams.  Darren McFadden used it to devastating effect for Arkansas in 2006-2007 (both years where the Razorbacks faced Bo Pelini's LSU defenses).  Rex Burkhead used it with some success in 2010.  Kain Colter was a weapon as a Wildcat quarterback for Northwestern.  But the common element for these players is that they largely were used when the other quarterback options were less than stellar.  Casey Dick was only a middling SEC quarterback at Arkansas.  Burkhead was drafted into service after a Taylor Martinez injury and to complement a so-so Cody Green.  Colter's main competition behind center was Trevor Siemian, a modestly productive pocket passer.  None of these situations was a screaming endorsement for the other options at quarterback.

Bo Pelini has shown that he can win a number of ways.  In 2008, his passing offense carried the team.  In 2009, his defense led the way.  The 2010 team was more balanced until injuries forced it to become a ball-control team that used the Wildcat.  The 2011 and 2012 teams were mostly carried by a mulitple offense.  Last year, the offense carried things early until the defense took over as the team rode Ameer Abdullah.  The recipe for success in 2014 will probably rely on defense.  The tandem of Randy Gregory and Vincent Valentine will need to be disruptive enough to allow the offense to again lean on Abdullah.  You'd like to see great things in the passing game, but the move of Turner suggests that that's not terribly likely. 

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Comments 134 comments so far

Well, RK3 is gone, Stanton is a total rookie, Fyfe probably not gonna cut it, as well as Broek.  Need a guy with some on the field, gametime experience to b/u TA for now, case he goes down and til JS gets up to speed.  Who ya gonna call?  JT, the obvious, most logical choice:  4*, top 10 dual threat QB when he signed.  I’ve been waiting for this moment and, who knows, JT may steal the whole QB show, wouldn’t surprise me one bit.

Welcome to Cluster F**k Island. The home of Husker football.

Maybe the depth at reciever puts him in a posistion where he won’t see the field as much.  Doesn’t mean our QB situation is in “cluster f**k” until we know the real reason, why throw some kids under the bus saying they are not up to standards.  I believe the coaches and players are willing to do whatever helps this team be as successful as it can be.  “it doesn’t send the message that the Huskers have an over-abundance of depth behind center”  unless someone has some inside information it is just speculation as to why he is moving or being asked to move.

i think you’re reading quite a bit too much into this.  The way I see it is this:  More competition = better performance.  They’ll push one another…all of them….to become the best QB for the job.  Just the fact that he’s being considered shows Armstrong that he isn’t just going to be given #1…he has to fight to earn it.

Turner is not going to win the competition, period.  He’s going to be a Wildcat QB and run about 10 plays out of 5 different formations.  But if Armstrong craps the bed or gets hurt, we need some options and that’s where Turner comes into play.

“Speculate” is the middle name of all of us and that’s what we do from now till Aug. Happy “speculating” guys. Like I said yesterday—very interesting for JT to be back practicing at QB when all of us thought we were sitting quite good (albeit inexperienced) at QB. Can anybody raise their hand and honestly say they saw this coming. Not me.

“I met with coach (Tim) Beck and he said, ‘I think I want to move you to quarterback. You’ll still play receiver. If you win the job, you’ll be quarterback. If not, you’ll just stay receiver.’”

Nothing’s a given here.

I mentioned that JT thingy yesterday on the Carr blog.  I’m still scratching my butt trying to make sense of it….what’s the purpose of redshirting a QB like JS theoretically to give him longer eligibility, only to throw him under the bus for lacking experience when he becomes eligible to play?  I believe we need to take a closer look at NU player development, recruitment and coaching philosophy in general.  I can’t believe that J Stanton (and others) has learned so little in a season of redshirting that it would keep him from competing this year…. and Apparently Jamal didn’t demand a chance at QB…the coaches asked him to do it for some obscure reason.  If we are to believe all those highly touted QBs really aren’t bringing anything to the table in the way of talent, ball handling, passing, and running, then what?

Maybe we’re looking at this from the wrong angle.
Maybe the coaches are not satisfied with how JT’s progressed as receiver, and are trying to find a way to get this 4* guy on the field.

Last year he was injured - part of the year.  Did that prevent him from catching balls or getting open?  If so, why was he on the field?

This is why Bo likes closed practices, people make more out of the little things and start rumors over something that could very well be just an option on giving us some different plays to use in special situations.  Than when he closes the practice you complain that he is not upfront on the program enough, needs to be more media freindly.

What was y’all thinkin’ when Tater and Hail Mary guy left, that JS or the Bagpiper or Broek would just step right up to the plate?  Memo:  they is all rookies.  Me thinks JT is a good move and I been wanting, for a long time, to see him behind center.  Thing is, if he DOES become b/u there, he won’t be on the field much bustin’ moves, which is where we really need him at all times.  Maybe he can still play WR unless needed to come in for TA.

Ball

You have to wonder. If I remember upon his arrival he went straight to WR and never took any snaps under center.

<blockquote>.what’s the purpose of redshirting a QB like JS theoretically to give him longer eligibility, only to throw him under the bus for lacking experience when he becomes eligible to play?</blockquate>

This statement assumes you know what is going on…you don’t.  JS could be just fine.  Beck might be putting JT back in for the wildcat only and telling others he’s in it to win it JUST TO STIMULATE COMPETITION. 

People who read into this make my head hurt.

T-Dogg

In my books the more snaps he is on the field the better. He has the body—if he has the brain for QB—I say more power to him.

Let’s try this again shall we?  Without the spelling errors now…

<blockquote>.what’s the purpose of redshirting a QB like JS theoretically to give him longer eligibility, only to throw him under the bus for lacking experience when he becomes eligible to play?</blockquaote>

This statement assumes you know what is going on…you don’t.  JS could be just fine.  Beck might be putting JT back in for the wildcat only and telling others he’s in it to win it JUST TO STIMULATE COMPETITION.

People who read into this make my head hurt.

wow I can’t buy a break today   :(

dk

You need a cup of coffee

DK,

It’s the slash in your closing of the blockquote.

Your using the wrong one.

Rex Burkhead used it with some success in 2010…  But the common element for these players is that they largely were used when the other quarterback options were less than stellar.  Casey Dick was only a middling SEC quarterback at Arkansas.  Burkhead was drafted into service after a Taylor Martinez injury and to complement a so-so Cody Green.

Wouldn’t that have been Zack and not Cody in 2010?

DKdevine, Maybe we’ll have TA returning punts and running WR routes, (sure handed catcher that he is),  but you have one thing correct, I sure as hell can’t make any sense of it because I couldn’t possibly know what Beck is thinking, never could, never will.  I can’t believe that Beck has some brilliant masterful plan to create greater competition by keeping everybody guessing as to which positions they may or may not actually play this year if they get to play at all, that is.  I hope I don’t get entertained again this year watching NU players running into each other trying to figure out what they’re supposed to be doing.  I, for one, can’t imagine that it requires confusion and uncertainty to motivate players to compete for positions they were recruited for in the first place, they’re all inately fierce competitors or they wouldn’t be there at all.

Sorry, I spelled his name wrong.

Zac Lee not Zack Lee.  Cody was a sophomore in 2010. Zac was a Senior.

DennisR ~ Oh please, don’t criticize our cherished OC Beck!!!  You either back the coaches 110%, or you are simply a traitor.  No place for criticism on this blog post!!!

NU Realista,

Oh please, don’t criticize our cherished OC Beck!!!

Ok, that was funny. :)

TA returning punts and @ WR?  K, thats cornplete insanity.  And everybody criticizes Beck.

Why don’t you use just ” marks like everyone else? 
Reminds me of the guy training his new puppy when he got out of his pickup truck, pointed, and said “stay”, then walked to the middle of the street, stopped, pointed back at the truck again and loudly said “stay”, then continued across the street where he turned once again, pointed,  and even louder shouted, “STAY”.  A woman on the sidewalk observing all this asked the man, “Why don’t you just put your truck in PARK like everyone else?

Cant agree more Dennis. None of it ever makes sense.

Beck is obviously trying to retain the zone read as a possibility for explosive plays and he knows neither TA or JS are as explosive as Jamal. Plus adding these plays in gives opposing defenses that much more to prepare for. You’re not just preparing for Jamal running the zone read, you’re preparing for play action off of it and reverses and HB passes back to Jamal Turner. It’s Tim Beck 101. Be as multiple as you can to aggravate the opposing DC and confuse the other team.

R House, how is that working for Beck.  It seems to just confuse the Huskers offence, not the other team.

What took so long, been telln guys since he first changed pos. That we should usr him to mix up our offense, maybe even dump it off on him then have him throw to an open armstrong or stanton. But this in a prrfect world i like the idea tho

This is why I don’t like Beck much, his decision making is suspect. That’s why I think Bo is reeling his offense in, simplifying things. Turner practicing at quarterback only takes snaps away from the core. 
Stanton and Armstrong are loosing opportunity to grow while Beck seems unfocused.

Players switch positions all the time, especially the whole WR/dual QB dynamic.  JS apparently isnt ready to be the #1 b/u.  And where are all the ‘walk-on warriors’ here saying we are lucky to have Ryker Fyfe instead of 5* players, since you know, he’s all ‘brave heart’ and such.  Oh wait, JT was a 4* recruit and thats why they can just plug him in wherever.  Ryker Fyfe is apparently not even 3rd string on the depth chart.  Hey, we should recruit more 2* guys though, doesnt matter, right?

Seriously, some of you guys really gotta get over yourselves.

I am confused, because I haven’t seen a depth chart yet and some of you have JT at the top or #1 back up already.  I think if JT was that good he would have been taking snaps at QB even with TM back there you know just in case TM got “hurt”.  I think the scenario will play out that maybe the coaches seen an attitude that he wasn’t all that happy or didn’t have the nerve to go over the middle to catch passes and that his talent was to good to waste completely so they are designging plays to try and get him on the field.  TM has been injured the last 2 years and no snaps back there for JT with very little back up in the past.  Of course with no media at practices who knows maybe he has been taking some snaps all along for these plays and we just didn’t know.  Until we see something on the field with him I am not making as much of this as all else.  We have seen in the past that rumors do nothing good for the team, but gives the lonely hearts something to write or complain about.

Listen guys…there is no Armstrong isn’t ready or they must not have confidence in Johnny Stanton.  They’re adding a guy in to work out of the wildcat.  Period.

Telling him he can win the competition is motivation for him to do well…and it’s true…because we have a full on QB competition for the first time in many years.  So, it truly is open.

But there is no conspiracy.  keep these crazy ideas and votes of no confidence to yourself because they do NO good whatsoever…calling these young men out and thinking you know whether they are good enough to play is pretty low class.

It might be better for us to consider the benefits that happen when Turner is competing:

1.  More competition = better end results for who wins
2. More dynamic offense with Wildcat
3. If JT knows more than the Wildcat, it’s harder to game plan for him

As an example, when we ran the Rexcat…not many people expected him to throw for very far.  If we have someone who can both run and throw back there…it gives us an extra weapon and something defenses have to play for.  I’m not sure how that is a bad thing.

JT is an example of someone the current coaching regime ‘sacrificed’ for the sake of sticking with TMart.  No honest thinker can say JT has been developed as a player to his highest and best potential while at NU.  He is an example of many such situations at NU.  Sad, but true.

Good job, Bo!

NU you really think this doesn’t happen at every University? You find that you have more talent at one posistion than you can get on the field so you ask and see if one of them will move.  This happened with Crouch.  I would imagine that Alabama does this to so that means if Nick came a calling you would bash him too?  So who do you want as the coach here? So why leave him on the bench if he is talented enough to play another posistion?

I’d also like to call to attention the following fact:  Jamal Turner has taken snaps EVERY YEAR HE HAS BEEN HERE.

The difference is that this year, the QB job is up for grabs…which means anyone who takes snaps has a chance to win it.

Now can we put this to rest?

I suspect it would be difficult to get ready to play if a QB never touches a football.  It seems to me that developing a WR’s skill as a backup QB would take a lesser role in practices than, for instance, developing a highly recruited redshirt duel threat QB , or QBs, for that purpose.  Wildcat plays are effective occasionally and when utilized sparingly, but like all trick plays they’re a lot less confusing when used frequently.  As someone once said,
” You can fool some of the people all of the time and all the people some of the time, but you can’t fool all the people all of the time”.  A talented, good, consistent, duel threat QB can make things happen every play.  In days of Yore, everyone knew what NU was going to do on nearly every play, the problem for opponents was figuring out how to stop them from doing it.  That skill level in all positions came from practice, practice, practice.  Just sayin’.

@dkdevine
Really do not agree with much of what Hanway has to say in this particular article. Think your assessment is right on. Glad to see some reasonable comments from other posters as well. As usual, also see more of the HUA, dumb-as-dirt drivel from Admiral, Realista, and a few other no-nothings whose sole purpose in life seems to be bashing the coaching staff and polluting the message board with unfounded speculation undermining the players and football program. Have come to expect nothing more from these SFBs, but it is really depressing to have to wade through all that negativity while trying to follow developments in Husker football. GBR!!

dk

Are you kidding? We have 5 months to sit and speculate and this one is not going away. We will talk about this till August unless by the end of spring ball he is back to full time receiver. If I was a betting man I’d put my money on R House’s guess. QB by committee. Each guy has his own strengths. JT comes in to supply what the others lack. TM was the one QB that blew up MSU and what he had JT has the best chance of replacing. Spot duty. That’s my guess.

For those of you who accept 4 loss seasons six years in a row and defend the current coaching regime, have some more Kool Aide!!!  Blind faith is not healthy, nor does it produce necessary change.  For you die-hards with unquestioning faith, tell us how many years an NU football HC should have to produce a consistent top 10-15 team?  Afterall, that does occur at other university programs, and used to occur at NU until Solich was fired.  Perhaps the bigotry of the low expectations disease has finally infected your respective brains.

Go ahead.  Offer your inifinite wisdom on how may years is acceptable to achieve a modicum of consistent excellence.

In the spring game when JT was a frosh, he ran a punt back for a TD and almost a k.o return for the same, played QB and was flinging it around pretty good.  Guess the ‘knowledgeable’ fans forgot about that.

@Realista,

So, your logic is stupid and wrong.

Supporting the coach != accepting 4 losses per year.

!= means does not equal if you’re unfamiliar with logic (which, I suspect you are).  it’s not black and white.  Stop trying to push everyone into a category so it’s easier for you to insult them.

My insight and wisdom is as follows….
1.  Do not try to classify the fanbase into tiny compartments so it makes your argument easier
2. Do not try to use faulty logic when talking about the coaching staff or wins/losses


You’d be wise to pull your head out…it’s pretty plain to see what you’re trying to do with your comments…but those of us that do see what you’re trying to do feel very sorry for your stupidity…much in the way we’d look at a dog chasing its tail.

NU Realista,

Carefull now.  The last time you and I got into a discussion about blind faith, Nebraska wound up beating Northwestern with a last second Hail-Mary touchdown.

Solich should not have been fired.  That part you got right.  But he was, and it made all of us look like we wanted to be a “win at all costs” program.  That was complete bull.  Plus the powers that be didn’t have anyone else lined up or waiting in the wings.  Personally, I thought it was because we were simply going to advance an assistant coach into the position.  The most logical choice at that point would have been Pelini, but they fired him too after the bowl game.

The “biggotry of low expectations” has nothing to do with it.  We got our coach back, we got our University back, and we got our tradition back.  As for the rest, that all comes with time.

By “no nothing’s” do you mean ‘know nothing’s”?

Kind of ironic, don’t you think?

Got your university back and got your tradition back? I thought Nebraska’s tradition was winning championships and kicking ass, not getting ass kicked resulting in no championships.

Your coach doesn’t recruit better than Solich did. Solich was able to win more games than Pelini has. He also had higher ranked teams than Pelini, and the last I remember, Solich had maybe 2 games that his teams got totally blown out in, and that cost him his job.

I want to ask BRN’s Tom Cudd’s honest opinion if he thinks Nebraska has it’s tradition back AND their university back? TC is not a sunshine pumper, so his opinion I will trust.

If Tom Cudd thinks so, I will believe it.

Question?  8-4, 10-3, 8-5, 13-1, 9-3, 7-6, If that was Bo’s record you would want his hide like you do now.  This is Nick’s 5 years at LSU and first year at Alabama.  This is not his first years as a head coach or coaching some mid level school. 55-22 I am not comparing Bo to the now Nick but if you think about it would you have wanted Nick Saban as your coach at the time looking at his record than? Someone took a chance and paid him good money (at the time) to learn on the job, I am not accepting the 4 loss seasons for what I want this program to be.  But I also know that to develope something you need time and patience to let things fall into place.  We are seeing some strategies change in recruiting, and I believe we will see others given time.  Most of us true husker fans realize this and are willing to let things develope.  For those of you that aren’t, name us a coach that would come in here and do better?  And don’t just throw names to be throwing names, I want to know who it is that is willing to come here and if they don’t win 10 games every other year, conference championships, in the hunt for National titles every 3-4 years wants this job.  I understand things are not where we want them to be right now, top 10 rankings are great but give this program time to heal from the BC years.  Recruiting was on a down hill slide with Solich and now I think we are on the up side in recruitng, not perfect but getting better.

http://www.dailynebraskan.com/sports/tegler-pelini-s-record-stands-out-among-coaches-despite-fans/article_9fea7a20-5d75-11e3-9072-0019bb30f31a.html

Of the 2,053 men who have ever coached major college football, 107 – about 5 percent – had winning percentages of .706 or better through five seasons.

Of those 107 coaches, 43 are in the College Football Hall of Fame. Sixty-two worked before World War II. And eight – much less than 1 percent – won nine games in each of their first five seasons as a head coach.

Of those eight, only one inherited a team with a losing record.

His name is Bo Pelini.

And Bo Pelini is on the hot seat.

A vocal minority of Nebraska fans harangue Pelini for an inability to live up to the standard. But the real standard in Nebraska isn’t winning conference championships. It isn’t winning national championships.

The standard coached the Huskers for 25 years.

The standard’s name is Tom Osborne.

Four seasons into his tenure at Nebraska, Osborne was on the hot seat, unable to live up to the standard set by his predecessor: Bob Devaney, who led the school to its first two national championships. After the 1976 Huskers (who finished 9-3-1) rallied to beat Texas Tech in the Bluebonnet Bowl, some university regents told Osborne that had he lost the game, he might have been fired.

But Osborne stayed, for 21 more seasons, and he went 60-3 in his final five seasons, winning three national titles along the way and creating the standard every following Nebraska coach would be compared with.

But it’s completely unfair to compare Bo Pelini to Tom Osborne. Pelini can’t be Osborne, because nobody can be Osborne.

Osborne is the only coach in history with more than 250 victories and fewer than 100 combined losses and ties; his career ended with only 49 losses and three ties. Osborne ranks fourth all time in winning percentage among coaches who worked more than 10 seasons. Of the top 18 coaches on that list, Osborne is the only one with more than 173 wins – with 255 wins.

And the eight coaches with nine wins in each of their first five years? He’s one of them. So is Oklahoma’s Barry Switzer, who won nine games in is first eight seasons – the second-longest streak ever. But Osborne? He won nine games in his first (and only) 25 seasons.

From 1973 to 1997, Nebraska fans were spoiled by arguably the greatest coach in the history of the sport. They were conditioned to believe that a football program could contend for national championships every other year and make it look effortless.

Osborne’s successors – just like every other coach in college football – have failed to live up to the standard.

Frank Solich, who coached the Huskers from 1998-2003, had the exact same winning percentage (.754) through five seasons as Osborne. Solich took Nebraska to a national championship game, had a team finish the year ranked No. 3 in the nation. But one bad season – which still included a trip to a bowl game, mind you – doomed him.

Solich’s successor, Bill Callahan, had two losing seasons in four years, and by the time he was fired, the program was trending downward.

That brings us to Pelini.

In his six seasons at Nebraska, his first six as a head coach, the highs have not met the standard, and the lows have caused knee-jerk comparisons to Callahan. But through it all, in the big picture, Pelini’s teams have been consistent; pessimistic critics point out that Pelini has lost four games each season. But Pelini has also won at least nine games each season.

Detractors argue that because college football teams play more games than they used to, it’s easier to win nine games in a season in the modern era. Yet only two coaches since 1990 – Pelini and Boise State’s Chris Petersen – have opened their careers with five straight nine-win seasons.

The Nebraska fans who want Pelini fired for on-field performance are living in the ’90s. Winning takes time, patience, more than six years. Osborne didn’t win an outright conference championship until his ninth season. He shared a conference title in his third season – but so did Pelini. In 2010, Nebraska finished the season tied for the Big 12’s best record, a feat that would have earned a league title in pre-conference championship game days.

Osborne inherited a team that had won back-to-back national championships a year before his tenure started, and he didn’t coach a national title contender until 1982, his 10th season.

Pelini inherited a 5-7 football team – yet he was held to the lofty standard of Osborne’s accomplishments after only a few seasons at the helm.

Other people want Pelini out because of his behavior; whenever Pelini is discussed on TV, a montage of footage with Pelini’s yelling and ranting and raving is shown. And that creates an image Nebraska fans don’t want.

But image is all about context. As Florida coach Will Muschamp (who is on a hot seat himself) said on “College Gameday” recently, victory justifies anger. When you’re winning, people call you passionate, he said. When you’re losing, they say you’re out of control.

At the end of the day, Pelini has a winning percentage of .704 in nearly six seasons. In his first five years, he had a winning percentage of .706. Better than Nick Saban. Better than Bear Bryant. Better than Lou Holtz, Bobby Bowden, Bo Schembechler, Jimmy Johnson, Frank Beamer, Steve Spurrier, Les Miles, Pop Warner, Amos Alonzo Stagg and, oh, by the way, Bob Devaney.

With a victory in the coming bowl game, Pelini would become the fifth coach ever to win nine games in each of his first six seasons, joining Osborne, Switzer, Petersen and George Woodruff, who coached Penn in the 1890s.

Fifth. Coach. Ever.

Pelini has worked under the shadow of three national titles by one of the best coaches in history, and while he hasn’t spoiled Husker Nation, it would be unfair to say he has underwhelmed. Have there been bad losses? Yes. Have there been embarrassing moments? Yes. But if Pelini is fired for winning at least nine games a season, you’d be hard-pressed to find another person who wants to coach under that cloud.

Nobody wants to coach a program with unrealistic expectations. Nobody wants to face a rabid, impatient fan base. Nobody wants to work at a place where nine- and 10-win seasons get you fired.

For now, there is only one man right for the head coaching job at Nebraska.

His name is Bo Pelini.

Nuff said!

Comparing Pelini to Osborne is quite frankly, embarrassing. Comparing Pelini to Nick Saban is extremely embarrassing.

Don’t go there, dude.

If you must compare Pelini to 2 ‘legends’, tell me why Bobo’s teams don’t show up when the hardware is being passed out? Oz and Saban have a gazillion trophies between them to a few ‘we sucked less than the other teams in our division’ trophies.

Smoke and mirrors, boys. Wake up man, Florida State’s even winning trophies now.

Don’t you want a trophy too?

Special emphasis on the “For now”.

‘Nuff said’.

When people are critics of a coach and use records to make there point you have to use something in return to make yours.  And why not use the records of some of the best coaches in college football.  I don’t think anyone is saying that Bo is the next Tom or Nick, I think what is being said is that they all took time to get all the pieces in place to get to the top of their sport.  Why not give another coach the same consideration.

Larr,

You see, you get it.  Why don’t the rest of them?

Simple they don’t choose to, would have nothing to say than.

OU7Times,

Um, I will go there, and as the author of the article points out, there is no issue with going there.  Bo wasn’t simply being compared to the so-called ‘Legends’ of college football.  He was being compared against ALL 2053 Coaches who have ever coached major college football.  So I don’t know where the there is that you say we shouldn’t go?

Bringing logic to an argument based on feelings may lead to divorce.

I quote from a Bleacher report story about the newly created QB controversy involving JT’s involvement:
“However, Pelini needs to be careful. With a quarterback controversy already brewing, the addition of another potential starter just might complicate the issue more than necessary.”

There are credible sources who don’t drink the Kool Aide and raise concern about Bo’s judgment.  This is yet another example of BOP’s inability to think strategically and correctly.  Yes, BOP has made some good decisions, but he has also made some horrible decisions.
Lest I point to the Iowa slop fest BOP created during and after the Iowa game.  BOP has maturity issues that carry over onto the field and post-game.

If BOP was doing better than 4 losses a season, tolerating such immaturity might be acceptable.  However, BOP isn’t consistently improving his results at NU.  Tim Miles is, for instance.

Again, this will be the season for folks like Johnny, BallField 78 and others to put up or shut up.  That means winning games not on a hope and prayer, but by defeating teams with a modicum of dominance.  Losing just two games would be a great stride and perhaps build some confidence in his coaching ability.  Anything less means BOP has shown he can do no better than middle of the pack results.

Its not all about wins and loses.  Its how Bo looses games and how he sometimes has to come from behind to win.  Yes Bo’s teams have been consistent with winning 9 or 10 games, but they have also been consistent with turning the ball over, bad decisions, bad coaching, a bad D, horrible play calling, not showing up for big games, and not playing hard through all 4 quarters. No its not all Bo’s fault. Its takes a team effort to be so UNCONSISTENT. Sure its fun to dream and think that the Huskers will win the BIG in 2014 and in 2015 maybe a NC, but in reality world its not going to happen. The so called tradition some of you think that is still there, isn’t.  Is it Husker tradition to get your ass handed to you by Iowa at home, and then on top of that have your head coach act like at total idiot both on the field and to the media. Is it Husker tradition to have the head coach of the best fan base in the nation trash talk the fans. Yes the tape was a dirty move but that don’t erase the facts. When and if Bo goes, its not going to be because of wins and loses. Bo is his worst enemy. I hope I am wrong and that he can turn things around. Just like the rest of you, I want them back into NC contenders. Finishing in lower part or even out of the top 25 isn’t Husker tradition.

Again, this will be the season for folks like Johnny, BallField 78 and others to put up or shut up.

???

I thought that was last season?
Unfortunately, ‘twill ne’er be the season for Unrealist, OU812, or Gilligan…

@Realista,

Labeling Bleacher Report as a credible source is asinine.  You gave me a good laugh though.  It also tells me all I need to know about you.

BallField78, I think you are the guy lost on fantasy island

Yea, no one wants to play golf with Pelini either.

NU spoiled him so much he takes a mulligan on every hole.

Maybe Bo Pelini should be careful before he ‘thinks’ out loud next time.

Arrogance is what it is when someone doesn’t think about what they say in front of other people afiliated with NU sports. That was about as much of a rookie move as anyone has ever made. He’s made it work for him though. NU is eating out of his hands now.

Just because they don’t ‘spin it’ like dkdevine likes it, they are shit.

I got it.

Johnny,

Not all of those 2053 coaches had the luxury of playing in watered down Big 12 Dorks and Big 10 Bludgeoned conferences for the whole of their first 5 years, but last year MSU was a beast.

Now he needs the bowl game to reach 9 wins.

I may be on Fantasy Island, but I’m neither lost nor complaining.  After all, it’s my fantasy, something I have control of.  I know where I’m at and happy to be there.

Some things I have no control over:
Head coach at NU
QB at NU
How many games NU wins
Anything posted by others on this board.

Admiral,

I hate to be the one that has to break this to you, but the B1G is not the B12.  We are no longer in a conference where we have to worry about only 3 of the 11 other teams in the conference.

The B1G has 13 teams in it that can go toe to toe with anyone else.  Our greatness is why they brought us into this league.  Yes, we lost to Iowa this year.  Wow, of the three times we played them we lost once.  ALL IS LOST,  ALL IS LOST!!! Please….

We played Iowa 3 times and lost once.
We played Northwestern 3 times, and lost once. 
We played Michigan st. three times and lost once. 
We played Michigan three times, and lost once. 
We played Minnesotta three times and lost once. 
We played Wisconsin three times and lost twice. 
We played Penn St. three times and have yet to lose. 
We played OSU twice and lost once.
We played Purdue once and won.
We played Illinois once and won.
We have not played Indianna yet.
We have not played Rutgers yet.
We have not played Maryland yet.

Even now in our 4th year in the conference we have yet to play all the conference teams that were in it when we joined.  To say nothing of the two new comers.  We went to a conference championship in our second year in the conference.

What does the B12 have?  Oklahoma…  That’s about it.

NU Realista,

Quarterback Controversy?  That whole article is out of whole cloth.  There is no controversy.  Bringing in JT for wildcat and zone read plays adds diversity and versatility to our offense.  Controversy?  Where the heck did that come from?

If this is the kind of cr@p Bo can expect from opening up spring practices to the press, I wouldn’t have a problem with him closing them down again.

Please tell us more about being “UNconsistent”, Admiral.

Johnny this is what I posted 50 spots ago
“This is why Bo likes closed practices, people make more out of the little things and start rumors over something that could very well be just an option on giving us some different plays to use in special situations.  Than when he closes the practice you complain that he is not upfront on the program enough, needs to be more media freindly.”
Couldn’t agree with you more shut it down and maybe some of these guys will go away, back to their real teams.

OU7Times,

Fine.  Name for me one other coach that has won 9 games or more in his first 6 years of being a head coach of a program with a losing record that also switched conferences half-way through his tenure?

larr ~ my real team is NU up to the moment Solich was canned by Pederson, and replaced with loser Callihan.  When BOP was hired, we were led to believe he would at least field a consistent top notch Defense since you can’t be a nationally ranked team without a solid “D”.  Guess what?  BOP allows the team to regress defensively over his 6 years.  God knows he wasn’t hired to be an offensive genius.  If he can’t produce on the “D” side, what the heck are we doing keeping him on - for his offensive genius???

Johnny ~ you constantly focus on 9 wins when what really matters is the number of losses.  NU has become irrelevant in the national scene for how many years of BOP’s management?  Lots of other teams seem to be in the mix.  Oh, I forgot.  They don’t have injuries.  I guess they don’t lead the nation in turnover ratio because they are lucky!!!  If the players screw up, its their fault.  If the players do well, the coaches deserve praise.  You can’t have it both ways.
NU Kool Aide drinkers are excuse makers who accept being second fiddle for how many more years?  By now, this team should be doing better than it has.  No one is asking for repeat NChampionships, just some relevancy in the national title chase from time to time.

Again, you all can trash those of us who have reasonable doubts concerning BOP’s abilities.  If BOP blows it again this coming season, please take a look in the mirror and ask why.

Johnny,
I like you but you need to know something. Nebraska switching conferences has a lot less to do with wins and losses than being able to hold onto the danged ball. Something a problem 2052 other 6th year head coaches should be 5 are removed from. If he took the time to drill pure fundamentals into his kids he just might have won a CC at the very least.

Would you at least agree to that, sir?

Year after year it seems to not be a priority with this guy.

He’s just plain ‘rogue’.

NU “my real team is NU up to the moment Solich was canned by Pederson” that was 10 years ago so you been complaining for 10 years?  Man life is to short to make this such a low part of your life, find a hobby I have concerns for your health.

The fumbling thing that was a problem when Solich, Callahan were here, maybe the problem is the running back coaches during this time?  It seems now when we fumble it comes at the worst times in games.  TM led the team in fumbles and was close to leading the country if I remember.  When your line sucks and it did with Barney there, the QB is getting hit and running for his life and shit happens.  Garrison seems to be changing that, to where we have really good depth and more time for the QB.  Like we have said we are starting to get the pieces in place just have some patience please!

OU7Times ~ Kool Aide drinkers refuse to acknowledge that BOP has personality problems that create choas for the team and excuses for losing and not performing well.  Despite the drinkers denial, the Iowa game revealed BOP’s true nature.  That was frightening and embarrassing for NU and the program.  The “rock solid” AD comes to his rescue and all of a suddent BOP is a changed man???  Don’t make me laugh.
Once it begins to come apart again this fall, you will see BOP lose his Kool Aide and, watch out.  He may be forcibly committed after the Iowa game in Iowa City should he choose to perform a repeat like the one this past season with Iowa.
Entertaining, but sad for NU fans who don’t drink.

Johnny, obviously the Huskers did not deserve to big in that CC game. Remember the score.  Bill K, do you have a point.

The 2014 football season can’t get here fast enuff!  This is awesome!!! Great point on both sides of the BO coin….. I wonder if Vegas has odds on how it turns out?
As For Turner - get the ball in the hands of playmakers - no problem.
GBR
Big Red in the Big Dance !

Turnovers?  Did someone mention Turnovers?  Why, let’s talk turnovers shall we?

http://www.cornnation.com/2013/12/17/5219920/history-and-perspective-for-the-husker-fan

How about statistics I posted in the above article that show Pelini led teams turned the ball over less than Tom Osbornes.

Enjoy having your mind blown.

Something “mind blowing” is that Tom Osborne’s teams must have been able to overcome fumbles/int’s and win. AND his teams always made you feel they were in the game and not getting BLOWN out.

Just my opinion, dk.

OU7Times,

Yes, fumbling has always been a problem, however lately the uptick has been quite troubling.  There was one game under Callahan where we had stopped Texas and were poised to win the game.  All we needed was a first down.  We passed the ball to the tight end.  He caught it.  ALL HE HAD TO DO WAS FALL DOWN AND THE GAME WOULD HAVE BEEN WON.  But nope, he turns toward the inside to run upfield and a Texas player puts his helmet on the ball.  Fumble, lost.  Change of posession.  Texas kicks field goal and wins game.

Yes, the fumbles are frustrating but they have always been there.  Granted in not this high a frequency, but they have always been there regardless of who the coach was.

@OU7

Osborne found ways to win AND lose…just like Pelini.  Back then, he lost 2-3 games per year until year 9.

What you’re doing is comparing Tom’s last 5 years with Bo Pelini’s first 6.  It’s hardly fair and it’s logically unsound.

I wrote about what you’re doing here and why it is wrong:  http://www.cornnation.com/2013/11/22/5133456/dr-osborne-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-worrying-and-embrace-the-huskers

Dkdevine,

Great Article.  Good job!

Admiral,

Nebraska did deserve to be in the CC that year.  It was Wisconsin, the same Wisconsin team that we defeated earlier in the year, that didn’t deserve to be there.  The only reason why they were there was because OSU and Penn St. were still on probation and couldn’t play “post-season” play.

Coincidentally, since it is a conference championship game and that by definition means its a conference game, why the heck consider it a post-season game?  Conference games should not be considered post-season play.

dk

Do you have a timeline? How about a timeline for Bo to start handling the press in a respectable manner? I’m genuinely curious. At some point even the most loyal fans turn. I have yet to find someone on here that didn’t turn on Callahan. Somehow he crossed some line where it’s alright to bash him without being considered a traitor. So what do you think? 10 years—perhaps 15. Is that long enough to expect respectability for the program? When does it become alright to turn on a guy? That’s my question.  I read both of your articles.

That year the Huskers gave up 63 to Ohio State and 70 in the CC.  Giving up points like that is total team meltdown. In TO’s first 6 seasons he beat some dam good teams and won a few good bowl games. I’m not saying that Bo should go, cause he is the guy. There is know one else, but if he has another 4 loss season, a few more sideline circus acts, and a couple blow outs. Then the excuses like, to many injury’s, bad calls by the refs, a young team, and we just didn’t execute need to stop. Bo should except the fact that what he’s doing isn’t working and make the correct changes to fix it.

Please Kool Aide drinkers!  You all use diversion tactics to distract from the truth.  Having one of the worst turnover margin rates of all Div. I schools doesn’t happen by accident.  Coaching has everything to do with it.  Claiming NU is on the rise (chant Hare Krishna and be Happy!) is a mantra that is getting old.  Just like Obama , BOP after six years owns the NU FB program, for better or worse.

One other observation you all don’t address:  Osborne hired BOP for his defensive skills, not offensive.  We have seen a consistent downward decline in defense after the first couple of years.  Offensive results in terms of consistent execution has never jelled.  It does no good to produce yards when you lead the nation in the turnover margin rate!  Thus, we have 4-loss seasons and a few ‘thank the Lord’ victories to keep the record at a mediocre level.

If NU doesn’t start to kick some butt this year and be coached to play smart FB with significantly fewer turnovers, he will be lucky to keep his job.  BOP’s chicken shit raging pitbull routine with spit to boot in the face of a ref, followed by an untimely 15 yard penatly and post-game $10,000 fine should no longer be tolerated.  Let’s hope NU can at least move from 100+ worst turnover margin team down to the 50+ rannking level.  Otherwise, someone needs to spit in BOP’s face so he knows what disresepct for the game and for those who enforce the rules really feels like.

That 10,000.00 fine was chicken-sH^T.  I agreed with Bo on that call and the fine to me was just another example of how the NCAA and the league needs to grow beyond this touchy feely crap and get back to football.  He doesn’t need to apologize to me about that.

And there it is again, the popular bad call excuse

Johnny,

I also do not care for CS call, but you have to look through the refs eyes first. The ref goes into the game already knowing what he can expect from Pelini or any coach for that matter.

There was spit involved and an aggressive gesture towards the ref. Pelini has gotten too comfortable with his sideline behavior and he pushed it over the line. In this day and age you just can’t trust unstable manored individuals.

This all not to mention how he responded at the presser. Saying he’s acted worse and nothing ever happened and then bring up Ferentz saying and how he acted.

At best, Pelini shows immaturity for a head coach and he needs brought back to earth, hence the fine.

If the ref made the right call to begin with none of this would have happend.  “Spit” was involved?  You know how many times I get sprayed on by folks around here who, well let’s just say english is not their primary language?  He waved his hat.  Hardly and agressive action.  It was a chicken-sH^T call to begin with and the ref didn’t have the cajones to admit it.

I’m fine with his so-called “sideline behavior.”  No, he is not mentally unballanced or any of that other crap the wimps in the media like to say he is.  Heck you say something in a moment of frustration and someone comes back and tries to burry you with it 2 years later?  You telling me that isn’t going to get under your skin?  Did that snake of a journalist get fired?  Probably not.  Because in the bizzaro world that is the liberal media, that cowardly cr@p is called investigative journalism.

Never mind the fact that we have a liar in the whitehouse who knows he was lying to the american people about keeping their doctor or healthcare plan.  Did he get fired yet?  Or how about that gem of a dork Harry Reid trying to say that all the people who lost their coverage were lying.  That is the kind of mentality you are dealing with when you deal with these so-called academians.  They all like to think they are smarter and know better.

17 trillion dollars worth of debt…  yeah, why, that’s a whole mess of geniuses working for us right there!

Pelini is as down to earth as they come.  He just doesn’t like stupid people.

OU, I don’t recall Bo saying he’s “acted worse”, but I must agree with the rest of this post.  I agree wtih Johnny that the call was bad, but Bo’s reaction was uncalled for.  You don’t make striking gestures at referee’s without getting a flag and I agree with the fine as well (although I think Bo can afford it.  Don’t know if he had to reimburse the U).  So he committed his offense, had to apologize, etc.  I see it as kind of like a coaches’ technical foul.  Not the end of the world or Nebraska’s public image.  Move on, don’t do it again.

@Ballfield78 and Johnny,

Seriously guys, I am not making this up. Sputum was photographed during the hat swipe towards the official. He did make a comment about acting worse and never getting flagged (like that was an accptable) excuse.

If Bo Pelini were in public and did to the ref outside the stadium, he would have been arrested. Plain and simple. Spitting on someone on purpose (doubt he did that), can lead to felony charges. Some of that is how it is reported and if the ‘victim’ wants to press charges. You add that with him swiping his hat near the ref’s face is why he was fined. The NCAA doesn’t want him to keep escalating his erratic behavior, so he was made an example of.

Tim Miles is winning right now but I wonder what people would be saying if he made the same remark ” all that hexing, and vexing bullshit” if we were 0 fer in the big ten?  Would people percieve him as a foul mouth coach?  I think if we were 13-1 and Bo has that same rant on TV or at the game you all would just love his passion.  I think he is a passionate guy, wears his personality on his sleeve for everyone to see good or bad, and loves his players and will defend them to the end.  Do any of us like the 4 losses, I doubt many do.  Do we wish he would maybe not be so vocal on the sideline with the officials, probably so but not to the extent that it looses his passion.  If he wins all this is for not.  I really see where this is divided fan base into the ones that want to give him more time and the ones that think he has run out of time which this argument will go on as long as he is here because if he wins the haters will respond to the I told you so from the willing to give more time crew and if he looses the haters will be doing the I told you so.  Some where this needs to hit neutral ground for all to get this fan base united again and help move this program to where I hope all on here want it to go.

Haa haa, Johnny,

See, I knew I liked you. Example was your whitehouse comments. I will be happy to ‘debate’ civilly with you on where we disagree. I can’t expect you or anyone else to feel exactly the way I do on issues regarding Husker football.

Larr,

Winning does cure all ails. Barry Switzer is a good example. People who like Switzer liked his cowboy like loose coaching style. Mostly because he won. When he was 7-4, his act got worn thin. I never saw a coch who took a loss better than Barry Switzer.

Although,...a ‘tie’ to Texas in 1984 during a rain soaked game is an entirely different subject.

So, if BOP wins, say, 12 games in ‘14, or 13, or 14, and at the end yells, “FUCK YEAH!”, I’m sure Las Duas Amigas will be bitchin’ that he “cussed”—in public even.

TDog,  ?????????????

Las Duas Amigas, Slim and Bim, Lone Ranger and Tanto, the 2 old Muppet geezers, take yer pick.

BOP is paid slightly more than $3 million, A YEAR, nowadays!!!  A muture responsible adult would know that requires a certain degree of civility BOP is apparently incapable of providing on a consistent basis.

Many of you suggest a coach who wins 13 or 14 games a season would otherwise be tolerated for such antics.  Problem with that assumption is, coaches who act like rabbid dogs, don’t usually reach those heights of season wins.  I suppose Woody Hayes would be the exception until he punched an opposing player in late 1970s during a game.  It clearly is not the formula for success in today’s era. Bobby Knight could only do his act for so long.

The State of Nebraska pay BOP well.  The University has allowed him to learn on the job and become a multi-millionaire in the process.  In return, it is reasonable to expect such a person to act like a mature man, keep his emotions in check, represent his team and the State of Nebraska like his life depended upon it.  Instead, he pulls the gigantic “chip” on his shoulder routine with inexcusable behavior at the end of the season.  Die-hards say, “Good for Bo!  He is standing up for his players and objecting to bad calls.”  Reasonable minds suggest, “For $3 million+ being paid to the man, we are entitled to our money’s worth.  We aren’t getting it with BOP.  Four loss seasons and emotional antics!”

Die-Hards—- what are you drinking this week?  Grape or Cherry Kool Aide?

Bo Pelini is no idiot.

He may look the part of a bum, give lame excuses, and hate the Nebraska fan base, but he figured out how to hold NU hostage.

He does what he wants, when he wants with who he wants.

I would think the powers that be at Nebraska would have been ready for the moment they knew was coming when he dared them to fire him.

Until Nebraska loses the ‘low budget’ mentality on hiring coaches, this will continue.

Watch basketball sometime and tell me how many of these coaches that are within 10 ft of the fans act like civil people.  coaching sports that has emotional ups and downs brings out the best or worst in all of them at times.  I am sure the great Bob Stoops never yells or loses his composure on the sidelines.  Since Bo grabbed TM the cameras have been more focused on him then any other coach in football.  Do I condone the behavior, not entirely but I also understand at times your adrenaline gets the best of you and like all of us we do somethings we wish we could redo.  I am sure if you have kids you have yelled at them a time or two and wish you could have that moment back for a redo.  Sometimes you get caught up in the moment.  And this week is Black cherry my favorite.

Just because others act badly is no excuse.

Here’s an example:

Lets say T-Dogg craps his pants everytime he smokes a bowl, sure doesn’t make it acceptable to us who don’t hang drywall.

Yuk yuk yuk.

Boooooyaaaaaaa!

7,

You wouldnt last one hour hangin’ drywall, and that is FACT.  In fact, I’m tryin’ to think of any useful, real world skill you might be good at, other than ass to mouth w yer girlfriend realistinha, know what I’m sayin’, muthafucka.  Here, check this out, I’m the guy in red, you’re the big dumb guy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWpzFusC4FU

We could only wish we had a FB HC who engaged in immature antics AND produced NC contending teams.  Unfortunately, we only have and tolerate the former, then fantasize about how next year will be different, that NU will be playing for something meaningful in a post season bowl next year.  Explain to me why living on a hope and prayer that NU NEXT season will finally be relevant is good enough.  Explain to me why having a HC acting like as ass during and after the final regular season game last season is laudible and something to be appreciated and defended.  If I had an employee who basically says, “Go ahead.  I dare you to fire me,” guess what?  I would fire him!!!  So would any right minded boss.

Only fools suffer idiots.  Are you Kool Aide drinkers fools?  Oh, excuse me - you must be idiots!!!  Keep drinking the Cherry Kool Aide.  It’s red.

NU if you haven’t been a fan of NU since Solich was fired why don’t you find another team to jump on the bandwagon through their Championship years.  Your comments on here have been heard loud and clear and you still have not made a difference in the mind of the AD and doubt you ever will.  So us koolaid drinking husker fans are going to back this coach, this team until we die.  Not just during the great years but through thick and thin!  And if they do get another coach at sometime we will back them as well, as that is the best we can do for this team is get behind and support them.  GBR!!

Larr,

Again, you’re right.

why living on a hope and prayer that NU NEXT season will finally be relevant is good enough. 

Because, regardless of who is coaching any given year, since we, as fans, are not on the field playing the game, nor on the sideline coaching, nor in administration making the big buck decisions, nor filling the pockets of the decision makers as boosters (at least not me) that’s the most influence we will EVER have, year after year.  Sometimes those prayers are answered (Osborne), sometimes answered in less orthodox ways (Devaney).  Consider that in 123 years of football, NU has 5 national championships from 2 coaches, all in the last 42 years, patience is a virtue but team support is a must.

Unfortunately, hypocrisy reigns supreme.  You all moaned and groaned when Callie was producing poor results.  Apparently, having a HC who consistently loses 4 games every year and doesn’t produce a relevant top 15 team after six years is acceptable to many of you.  You all have become the victims of low expectations in the name of team loyalty.  FB at NU is becoming what BB has been until this year at NU—- irrelevant.  Be proud of mediocrity, Kool Aide drinkers.  You deserve it.

First of all, any and all of us have the right to post our opinions on this site. Just because someone doesn’t support the way the coach handles the lows, many lows, doesn’t mean that he doesn’t support the players. NU an idiot will always back another idiot. TDogg, what the hell is up with the (a to m thing). Your a sick retard. You need to go sit on your couch on your front porch with the rest of your porch monkey friends, light up that blunt, and keep chugging the 40"s.

Hey, OU7 wants to ‘play’, we gonna ‘play’, and I dont ‘play’ nice.  Let that be a warning to the rest of yas.

Look out everyone, TDogg gona bust out his tech 9

NU Realista,

Good lord, sometimes I just don’t think you get it.  Larr and dkdevine have both posted great posts on how under Callie we not only lost games we lost our traditions.  The recognition of our Academic All Americans were taken down.  Tributes to previous players and accomplishments were taken down.  The administration got egocentric stating that we are only going to have scholarship players on our squad and all but destroyed the walk on program.

Our support of Pelini is not just about him getting us back to the unspoken yet widely held standard of 9 games a year.  But also because Osborne and Pelini brought back the walk-on program, the recognition of our Academic All Americans are back up and the academic standards are back in place.  Last years squad was the most academically strong squad since the 1980s.

For those of us who are true Nebraska fans, this is about more than winning.  And low be to the individual or individuals who dare screw with it again.

Johnny

Are you sure those calls were Callie’s and not Pederson’s? Are you sure that with TO’s help those things couldn’t have been revived with Callie still the HC? Was Callie the one dismantling all those things or was it Pederson?

GageCoHusker,

Directly to your point, no.  However, it was Callie that stated that we needed to get rid of the walk-on program.  As far as he was doing what Pedersen was telling him or whether it was his own decision, not withstanding.  The walk-on program would be a decision that he would have to agree with as an HC.  As it is directly under and affects his area of responsibility.  However, Pedersen being Pedersen and the academian ego being what it was, it would not surprise me if Pedersen wanted it done and Callie simply went along with it to not rock the boat. 

However, you are correct in that the problem did appear to be more Pedersen than Callahan with the Academic All Americans and the removal of memorabilia.

You guys live in a fantasy world if you think without winning all the laudible attributes of scholastics and boy scout honors mean anything.  This is all about winning, and in the process, you coat winning with all the fluffy ‘feel good’ stuff about us.  You start with winning.  Without winning you would not have any of the traditions you all speak about.  Let’s talk about all the traditions before Devaney came along.  Zero!  Nada!!!

NU Realista,

Actually, prior to 1940 Nebraska was the 7th overall winningest football team in the nation and we were 12 - 3 vs Oklahoma.  Nebraska has always had a tradition of winning with several undefeated seasons which would normally have afforded us a national title. 

However, during the war years and the decade that followed, most of the population and economic explosion in this nation occurred on the coasts.  Bob Devany did bring back the winning tradition at Nebraska but there are traditions that we have long had that were here long before he arrived.

Winningest College football programs 1869 - 1940.

1 Yale 0.82261 480 89 37 606
2 Princeton 0.80931 441 89 39 569
3 Notre Dame 0.79951 315 70 24 409
4 Harvard 0.77379 447 119 33 599
5 Michigan 0.76573 343 98 20 461
6 Minnesota 0.74460 298 94 25 417
7 Nebraska 0.73168 294 98 31 423
8 Pennsylvania 0.71601 459 173 30 662
9 Vanderbilt 0.71544 296 109 29 434
10 Army 0.71495 291 107 30 428

———————————————————————————————————-
11 Texas 0.70560 280 111 20 411
12 Pittsburgh 0.70205 295 118 25 438
13 Dartmouth 0.69748 317 129 30 476
14 Cornell 0.67773 306 140 21 467
15 Navy 0.65979 301 146 38 485
16 Ohio State 0.65972 269 131 32 432
17 Villanova 0.64646 326 169 41 536
18 Virginia Tech 0.64356 246 130 28 404
19 Georgetown 0.64269 255 136 26 417
20 Illinois 0.63902 248 134 28 410

Yale is also numero uno in the number of African slave traders that founded and funded that ‘fine’ institution—pretty much all of them, in fact.  Lord Phillip Livingston, V.P. John C. Calhoun, look it up.

Johnny ~ don’t be too excessive compulsive.  Nebraska gained statehood in 1867?  You go back to 1869 for football?  Traditions of the horse and buggy days?  Clearly, I was referring to post WWII, not post civil war!!!  My comments were to the more contemporary discussions you all were having about not posting Academic All American names, etc.  Thus, your analogy to a period starting 140 years ago is a bit absurd.  I think any fair minded person understood what I was saying, except you, Johnny Boy!

Head Coaches for Nebraska during the Dark Decades (1940 - 1960)
Biff Jones 1937 - 1941
Glenn Presnel 1942
Adolph Lewandowski 1943 - 1944
George Clark 1945 - 1946
Bernie Masterson 1946 - 1947
Bill Glassford 1948 - 1955
Pete Elliot 1956
Bill Jennings 1957 - 1961
Bob Devany 1962 - 1972 2 National Championships

Since its first year of playing football in 1890 Nebraska has lost 357 games.  1/3rd of all of Nebraska’s losses occurred between 1941 - 1961.  Changing coaches doesn’t always work out.

Johnny

No doubt Callie scaled the walk-on program back. He didn’t know it’s value and coming from the NFL didn’t know how to deal with so many kids. I just think it might be wrong to blame him for the other stuff. I just find it ironic that so many have no problem (because they are the majority) lambasting him most likely unjustifiably. In my mind his chief failing was his loyalty to Cosgrove. So a strength becomes his downfall. Bo displays the same kind of loyalty. Cosgrove was his best friend. What do you do with your best friends?

So here is the way it works for me. As long as people on these boards lambast Bill Callahan—I will point out Bo’s failings to them. Tit for tat.

NU Realista,

Your claim was that Bob Devany brought the tradition of winning to Nebraska.  The above posts were simply to show you that, he had brought it back to Nebraska, but it is not as if we never had it prior. 

Nebraska now being the 4th winningest football team in College football history is in no small part due to Bob Devany, Tom Osborne, Frank Solich and Bo Pelini, and to all the coaches who coached Nebraska from 1890 - 1940.

T-Dogg,

A fine point to bring up but let’s stick to football for right now.

“Johnny ~ don’t be too excessive compulsive.  Nebraska gained statehood in 1867? “

Yes that is correct.  Nebraska gained statehood in 1867.  Ten years prior to Henry O. Flipper graduating from West Point Military Academy as an officer in the United States Army.  The first Black American to graduate from that Academy.  (1877)

In 1890 the first Nebraska football team took the field.
IN 1891 the first Nebraska added to its roster the its first Black Athlete.  George Albert Flippin.

GageCoHusker,

I don’t hate Callahan personally.  Also, I am glad he has found success at Dallas.  I just never believed he was head coaching material.  Pedersen didn’t have a plan, nor did he do a very good job vetting candidates before hiring Callahan.  I fault Callahan for the on-field performance and the complete lack of defense and the cutting of the walk-on program.  Pedersen should be getting the jeers for almost everything else.

Fuhball has everything to do w modern day slavery—free labor, right, in fact most have to pay to work there—just axt Chris Rock. 

Pop Warner, Father of Fuhball, Yale, Skull and Bonesman, look ‘er up….

Callie actually recruited some top quality talent, including SUH.  His player development was lacking, however.  And yes, Cos was a big mistake to bring on board.  Callie just wasn’t the right fit.  I am not sure he is doing that well in Dallas, relatively speaking.

For Johnny, please read the following description of NU’s football program from 1942-1961 from Wikipedia:

“Slide into obscurity (1942–61)[edit]
Nebraska was led by three head coaches during the war years, with a scarcity of players available as so many of the country’s young men were abroad and at war. By 1945, the year the war ended, the Cornhuskers recorded a losing 11-24-0 (0.314) record.
The situation did not improve after the war, as Bernie Masterson (1946–47, 5-13-0, 0.250) recorded the worst head coach career winning percentage ever compiled at Nebraska in his first and only head football coaching appointment. Previous head coach George Clark (1945 & 1948, 6-13-0, 0.316), a veteran of both world wars with an extensive coaching pedigree and who led Nebraska in the final war season of 1945, returned as Nebraska’s coach for 1948 temporarily as a search was made for his successor, prior to his ascension to Athletic Director at Nebraska.
Clark hired Bill Glassford (1949–55, 50-40-4, 0.471), and Nebraska’s performance improved somewhat over previous years, especially after the 6-2-1 1950 season, and Nebraska’s second-ever bowl appearance, a 7-34 loss to Duke in the 1955 Orange Bowl.
Following Glassford, Pete Elliott, a star quarterback who led Michigan to the 1948 national championship, arrived at Nebraska for his first ever head coaching appointment. Although he would go on to achieve successes later in his career, he recorded a 4-6-0 (0.400) record in his one year at Nebraska. His replacement, Bill Jennings (1957–61, 15-34-1, 0.310) fared even worse at the helm, his final career record with the Cornhuskers being the lowest of all but three of Nebraska’s coaches.”

SO WHEN I MENTION DEVANEY TURNED THINGS AROUND, THAT IS ABSOLUTELY TRUE.  TRADITION AT NU DURING THE WWii AND POST-WWII PERIOD SUCKED!!!  WINNING PRODUCES TRADITION THAT PEOPLE LIKE AND REMEMBER.  LOSING ACCOMPLISHES NOTHING IN THAT REGARD, UNLESS YOU ARE AN EGG-HEAD FROM THE IVY LEAGUE WHO LIKES TO PLAY PRETEND FOOTBALL TO MAKE HIMSELF FEEL LIKE A MAN.

Hell, Dogg, you failed to even mention Red Ryder and Little Beaver!
During the mid 50’s prior to Bob Devaney coming on as coach, I recall getting in NU home games for free any time after the 1st quarter because most of the fans were leaving, when I got home from the service in 62,  not so much, in fact it was nearly impossible to get a ticket to a home game.

NU Realista,

Give it a rest, will you?  Heck, even God took a day off.  Devany did a fine job.  No one is arguing any different.  The point was that you attributed greatness and tradition to Devany winning games.  Our traditions here at Nebraska pre-date Devany.  Like when we were slotted to go to the Rosebowl in 1941 and fans decended on the capital and demanded that the Governor sing the school song.

Devany was 26 years old and hadn’t even begun coaching yet.

Denny,
Red Ryder, Beaver, they Skull and Bones too?

Johnny ~ the two points you failed to pick up on are 1) losers don’t create traditions that last the passage of time; and 2) NU’s record post WWII sucked.  You attempted to cover the losing “tradition” post WWII with NU FB program successes predating the birth of Jesus Christ.  Everyone realizes Devaney turned the program around when he came on board.  That was never the issue.  Incorrect spin must be corrected, however irritating that might be to you or some others.

Good lord it is bad when folks don’t understand why counter-points are necessary.

You guys live in a fantasy world if you think without winning all the laudible attributes of scholastics and boy scout honors mean anything.  This is all about winning, and in the process, you coat winning with all the fluffy ‘feel good’ stuff about us.  You start with winning.  Without winning you would not have any of the traditions you all speak about.  Let’s talk about all the traditions before Devaney came along.  Zero!  Nada!!!

Actually, there were plenty of winning traditions prior to Bob Devany joining the coaching staff.

Top 20 Winningest college football programs from 1890 to 1940.  ( I went ahead and limitted the list to only those teams that had played 400 or more games in that amount of time.

1 Notre Dame 0.80446 313 67 24 404
2 Yale 0.79733 372 83 31 486
3 Princeton 0.78761 340 80 32 452
4 Michigan 0.77199 324 89 19 432
5 Harvard 0.77122 359 97 27 483
6 Pennsylvania 0.75547 401 121 26 548
7 Minnesota 0.75124 291 88 25 404
8 Nebraska 0.73168 294 98 31 423
9 Vanderbilt 0.71544 296 109 29 434
10 Army 0.71495 291 107 30 428

————————————————————————————————————————
11 Texas 0.70560 280 111 20 411
12 Dartmouth 0.70542 299 117 27 443
13 Pittsburgh 0.70205 295 118 25 438
14 Cornell 0.67889 295 134 21 450
15 Navy 0.66740 287 134 36 457
16 Ohio State 0.65972 269 131 32 432
17 Virginia Tech 0.64356 246 130 28 404
18 North Carolina 0.63948 251 133 39 423
19 Georgetown 0.63930 244 132 26 402
20 Illinois 0.63902 248 134 28 410

The number one team on the list at that time is Notre Dame.  A team that by 1940 was tied in its win/loss/tie ratio with Nebraska.

11/26/1925 vs. Notre Dame (7-2-1) W 17 0
11/15/1924 @ Notre Dame (10-0) L 6 34
11/10/1923 vs. Notre Dame (9-1) W 14 7
11/30/1922 vs. Notre Dame (8-1-1) W 14 6
10/22/1921 @ Notre Dame (10-1) L 0 7
10/16/1920 vs. Notre Dame (9-0) L 7 16
10/18/1919 vs. Notre Dame (9-0) L 9 14
11/28/1918 vs. Notre Dame (3-1-2) T 0 0
10/20/1917 vs. Notre Dame (6-1-1) W 7 0
11/30/1916 vs. Notre Dame (8-1) L 0 20
10/23/1915 vs. Notre Dame (7-1) W 20 19

The store of Nute Rockne and the “Gipper” was actually a barrowed story from the 1922 Nebraska vs Notre Dame game in which Nebraska Trainer Jack Best who had been with the program since its inception in 1890 was physcially carried to the Nebraska locker room where he told the Nebraska players that this game will be the last he would see and he wanted a win.

During the tenure of the “Four Horsemen” of Notre Dame, Notre Dame only lost two games.  One in 1922 and one in 1923, both of them were against Nebraska.

So saying that Nebraska had “zero” or “Nada” in traditions prior to Bob Devany is complete bunk.  Additionally, it was after the 1922 game vs Notre Dame that a Horseshoe was found on the field.  That is the “horseshoe” that Nebraska players touch as they head out of the locker room on their tunnel-walk to the field.  A tradition that started at Nebraska when Bob Devany was 7 years old!

John, John, John ~ my reference to the past was WWII vintage going forward to Devaney.  You have moved the ball back to a point in time before the ‘big bang’ occurred.  Of course, there were periods before then that NU had success.  MY POINT IS—- you really don’t have traditions develop that last without winning.  Programs don’t celebrate “LOSING” traditions!!!  If so, they are really losers!!!

Now, you can try to nitpick all you want, but what I say is true.  Stick with the relevant time period leading up to Devaney—- post WWII.  Be sure to celebrate all those LOSING traditions after WWII that have lasted since then.

NU Realist,

I am prepared to stipulate that winning is important.  As long as you are willing to stipulate that winning traditions existed in Nebraska prior to the arrival of Bob Devany.  As for focusing on the post WWII period, eh…  Nebraska has been playing football for 120 years.  Over a 3rd of our total losses as a program occurred between 1941 and 1961, a period of 20 years.  Why anyone would focus on the worst 1/6th of our football history and state no winning traditions occurred prior to that is simply baffling.

If we were able to somehow remove those twenty years, Nebraska would be, without doubt, the winningest program in the history of college football.  Now, we cannot go back in time and erase those 20 years.  However, why focus on them to such an extent as to render any history previous to that irrelevant?  It makes about as much sense as Texas joining the B12 and stating that all history previous to that is no longer relevant.  (Which they actually tried to do.)

Thank you, Johnny.  My only point was, losing does not create winning traditions.  Post WWII proves the point.  Otherwise, it is what it is.

Go Big Red B Ballers!!!

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